Motley Moose – Archive

Since 2008 – Progress Through Politics

teh dkos

Almost everybody knows by now that Daily Kos rolled out a new version today. Lots of new stuff around but what has really gotten my attention has been the Groups function and how that could be a blogosphere gamechanger. So that’s what this diary/openthread is mostly about. I was responding in a thread on the Moose so I decided to put it up in the bright lights for those interested in the conversation.


Something I found interesting written by David Waldman a.k.a. Kangro X who runs the Dkos sister site Congress Matters.

(bold done by spiff)

Congress Matters (25+ / 0-)

CM was launched as a Congress-watching sister site to DK, as a home for the hard-core process wonkery, committee watching, and parliamentary sociology that would have otherwise clogged the front page of Daily Kos and driven you all crazy, but nonetheless had to be documented somewhere in easily-linkable form.

We ran much more intensively it as something of an experiment for a year or so, but soon realized there just wasn’t that much of an appetite. Still, it’s important stuff, so we kept it. But even though it was a sister site with identical username and password files, people just didn’t really want to jump over here.

In DK4.0, we’ll just migrate it over there as a group, and those interested will be able to get the content right there at “home.”

by David Waldman on Sat Feb 12, 2011 at 05:30:18 PM PST

Kos is closing down his other blogs (Street Prophets, Congress Matters, etc.) and putting them under 1 umbrella. I would guess those who frequented Open Left and found themselves without a blog home will eventually all meet up in a DKos group blog. I have no idea if that will be done but it seems like the logical step. It’s one of the reasons I like the idea. It’s an option not available before.  

A link to the Groups part of the DKos4 FAQ.

How is a Group Started?

One or more people get the idea for a group and decide to start it. The person who actually sets up the group must be a Trusted User, and is called the “founder”.

The main Groups page available from the front page menu and a user’s own My Groups page both display a Create New Group link to Trusted Users only. It doesn’t matter from which page you start: click on the “Create New Group” link. You will be taken to the “Create a New Group” page.

Creating a Group

There are three fields you need to fill out to create a group:

Group Username – this is the name the system knows you by. It will appear in your “See More By” box, in the web URL, and in your group’s Admin box. This name is permanent.

Group Name – this is your group’s “display” name, it’s blog name: it will appear in the blog’s “banner” to the left of the Daily Kos flag, in the header of any diary published directly to the group (by username for Group Name), in users’ lists of Groups they’re in or Groups they’re following, etc. It will be confusing if the Group Username and Group Name are not the same, or at least similar (for example, the Username being shorter than the Name).

Description – this should describe what your group is and does. Be concise; too long and people’s eyes will glaze over. The text will be shown as part of your group’s listing in the various lists on the Groups page, and also in the group’s “See More By” box when its blog page is displayed.

Once these are filled out to your satisfaction – the Group Name and Description can be edited later, if desired – click the Save New Group box. Assuming that your Group Username is not already used by another group or user account, your group will be created, and you’ll be ready to start work on it.

Here is what Kos and Meteor Blades let peeps know about how groups will work. I read this when it was initially posted which is one of the reasons I’ve been paying more attention to the new features. I think it’s pretty cool.

The Group is comprised of admins, editors and members.

1.  Admin is the creator of the group, but can choose to ask another person to handle administration of the group.  Admins add, remove and set privileges for users. After a person has been invited to join a group, the admin will add the person to the group and determine whether the person should be an admin, editor or member. The admin is also the person that can remove (ban) members from the group. The admin also has permissions granted editors.

2.  Editors have permission to edit diaries in the queue or published to the group blog, post diaries to the group, view diaries queued for the group and read private messages sent to the group.

3.  Members only have permission to post diaries to the queue and cannot view diaries queued or read private messages sent to the group. Thus, editors or admins will need to schedule or publish member’s diaries directly to the group blog.

Internal Group Rules

The DK4 system provides the technology for tools, but groups will have to decide how those tools are used:  For example, just because editors have the capability to edit does not mean that all editors should have the right to edit.  If a group has 50 editors, it might wish to limit editing rights to a handful of them.

That’s my spiffy roundup!



  1. Kysen

    (so why the HELL are you thinking like ME???)

    (I’ll let others judge if I am crackin’ on you or on myself)


    We actually have a Motley Moose username over on Dkos, but, ‘he/she’ has no Mojo so cannot create a group.

    I went ahead and started a group with ‘The Motley Moose’ Url (‘Motley Moose’ can only be used by the username ‘Motley Moose’)…it is called ‘Moose On The Loose’ at the moment, you can change the ‘name’ and ‘description’ of your group but you cannot change the Url.

    I have not sent out ‘invites’, I am still poking about.

    IF we decide to use the ‘Group’ function over on Dkos…I really do think it ought be either a ‘Weekly Round Up’ type deal with a brief overview of diaries HERE on the Moose (with LOTS OF LINKS), or, ought be used for material that is more ‘dkos’ oriented and not posted on the Moose (or, if already posted on the Moose, wait at the very least a week before posting to Dkos and use LOTS OF LINKS).

    I am still not convinced…not even close to being convinced…that we ought do much of anything with the Groups function on Dk4…but, at least now we have the URLs held if we do decide to do something.

    Very very interested in what people think we ought do (or ought NOT do).

    Thank you for posting a diary on it, Spiff. I think it is a good conversation to have.

    Carry On.

  2. Stipes

    I’m pretty ambivalent about it this morning.  

    The idea of forming a Moose group came up yesterday, but there was significant concern that it would start sucking traffic from here.

    If DK4 can reduce the number of pie fights and rec list wars, I’m all for it.  However, there is still a hard core group over there that is dedicated to driving folks like BlackWaterDog away…and they tend to use the same rhetoric as the right does when describing Obama and his supporters.

  3. Kysen

    it is just the new site working out bugs…but, if it continues to be as SLOW loading as it is…I will not be a frequent visitor.





    is frustrating.

  4. Stipes

    Just an FYI.  If anyone is using Opera, it won’t let you successfully login over there.

    Explorer works.

    Gonna try Firefox and Safari next.

  5. Kysen

    The more I look at it…the more it seems that adding people as Members is not really necessary.

    Every ‘member’ added is listed as an ‘Editor’ on the main page for the Group. I don’t think that the goal is to have umpteen editors…I think what we need Moose to do is FOLLOW the Group. I think adding every Moose as an editor would not be prudent.

    Here is the Main page for the Group:

    And there are still 4 or 5 invites out already.

    I would like to see how…say…Black Kos handles their ‘Members list’ before I invite any more.

    What do ya’ll think?  

  6. IL JimP

    I got a warning last week from MB because I had tip’d a comment that had “Obama haters” in it.  Apparently, this has become a punishable offense in my absence from the site.  

    Well, now because of that I guess I can’t be a TU and start a group.  I normally wouldn’t give a crap but it’s so silly and arbitrary that it obviously upsets me a little.  I guess I’ll go on as I have been without the ability to do my small part to save that site from the PL crazies.

    Oh, well.

  7. Kysen

    until we get a more firm grip on things…I am going to go ahead and ‘rescind’ the invites that are still open. Likely, if ever we move further on this…I will remove all of us from the Admin/editors list (including myself…switching myself out with ‘Motley Moose’) then, just as we do with facebook/twitter, there will be one or two people whose responsibility is to post whatever it is we have decided to.

  8. Kysen

    Ok, so added ‘Motley Moose’ to the account since any activity on it will most likely be thru that username. Made ‘him/her’ an Admin…..then used that account to ‘remove’ the existing editors/members…tried to remove ‘Kysen’ but, to my frustration,  got “cannot depose the founder”…so, dunno…that is where it sits now. I still think that it ought just be benched for now and we ought take a ‘wait and see’ approach….see how Black Kos and other established groups use the function.

    If you want to be a member of the group and have not yet done so, use your Dkos account to ‘Follow’ the Group. ‘Followers’ are the group’s ‘Members’ (Kos really could have made the whole thing more confusing…but, only if he tried REALLY hard).

    Here is the link.

    Click the wee heart ‘Follow’ that is on the left beneath the flag bearing man avatar, or on the right beneath the Group Name. That any future activity will show up in your ‘stream’ (/snicker).

    We will also make sure that, if we ever end up utilizing the function, a diary is put up here explain the hows/whys of it. For now, though, is basically a placeholder.

    So, for now, that is where it stands…if/when anything changes everyone will be notified.

    Carry on.

  9. Mind you, I tried the beta for weeks and knew what was coming.

    Basically, its balkanised social networking as a replacement for politics. Here is the triumph of ghetto politics, all reduced to our little irrelevant groups or enclaves. It’s buddy buddy stuff, and we lose the tempo and pulse of a collective moment…

    Mind you, Kos sacrificed that years ago when they let a fraction of a fraction guide the site’s politics.

    Aesthetically and in programming terms… it’s vapid bloatware. The sub magazine styling doesn’t make the words more authoritative, and the amount of empty space is way pretentious. DKos4 has convinced me that the fissiparous ecleticism of the American left will triumph over real debate and solidarity.

    So my advice to Kysen and others who think this will leverage more debate on the Moose.

    Don’t touch with a bargepole.  

  10. Shaun Appleby

    I find it hard to criticise Markos and Daily Kos.  The DLC folded up their tents recently and Markos is apparently going strong.  He has enough revenue to do polling which is reported nationally, a very powerful influence, has hosted presidential nomination debates and has enough change left over to rebuild his site.

    Maybe not my favourite site to hang out at but when it comes to establishing an alternate, populist forum for progressive politics and, hopefully, organising you must admit he has done something positive and remarkable.  If a culture of opposition to the incumbent Democrat is the worst side effect I still think we are better off.  At least Obama’s critics have a place to let off steam.  Let them have their primary challenge fantasies and GBCW dramas if they must.  Come election day Daily Kos will be pulling for the Democrat and holding Republicans to account as has been demonstrated in the past.

    Overall I think it is an immensely positive development.  As for sites which share the ethos of the Moose I read BooMan regularly and find his site well informed, courteous and incisive.  I wonder if the Moose might find some synergistic engagement with reasonable sites like his.

  11. sricki

    I think I like it.

    Part of my fondness comes from how customizable it is. Anything I can personalize as much as that, I like.

    But that’s just me.

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